Please tell me that this isnt exactly what the Fairness Doctrine was/is for. Correcting flat out lies. These three goons know exactly what the truth is, and choose to lie. It's infuriating.

They may be wrong about Obama (and I now must apologize to the left-wing about the whole Obamessiah image, I now see that it was the right-wing taking the left-wing out of context), but they are right about the issue about abortion and infanticide.

So you have moved from one right wing talking point that been so easily debunked and has made you look like a stupid twunt, onto a new one which will run for a couple of weeks letting you make snide little comments, unfunny jokes and ridiculous juvenile statements dragging it away from the serious point of all the treads before being easily deb unked and make you look like a stupid twunt? Good to know what we have to look forward to.  

I don't think abortion will run for just a couple of weeks.

Of course you don't. your a republican twunt who needs a wedge issue to give you a hummer so you have something to get your panties wet about and decry so called "evil liberals". The one thing l have NEVER heard so called "compassionate conservatives" or "pro-lifers" talk about is what happens to the unwanted children when they are born. I once heard soimeone say the most profound thing about the total hypocracy of conservative "pro-lifers" on both sides of the pond: "Love the fetus, hate the child". Or more realistically, ignore it now it's served it's political purpose.

We love the fetus AND the child. We try to do help the child succeed in whatever ways we can. Only we tend to do it through private organizations rather than the government.

Only we tend to do it through private organizations rather than the government.

Private organizations who's main goal is profit, children come in second.

Bingo, Pearlene. It's the same with healthcare.

For the most part Health care in this country is: diagnose a "disease" ( Which Dr. Linus Pauling ((nobel prizes in medicine and medical research)) says 99.9% are caused by mineral defficiencies) and prescribe a pharmaceutical to mitigate the symptoms. This part of the equation sounds like a SCAM to me. I saw the insHANNITY thing ( on TV) and while it totally PO'd me , It was sort of a typical insHANNITY diatribe. The "bleached bimbo" utterances were par for the course as well. I would like to get down to some serious retroactive birth control research. If that pill became a reality, gas prices would fall substantially, faucks news would be no more, and right wing radio airways would be filled up with soft rock and folk music. Retroactive birth control=a bridge over troubled waters.

OOPS. right wingers are pro death: send our troops to get killed in far off lands for the greed factor and a health care system which allow many to die because they can't afford the premiums or treatment. Left wingers are pro life. Sex education, free condoms to help abolish unwanted pregnancy, stem cell research and a true health care system (including preventative health care) for all.

It's so much easier to pretend to care about the unborn than the living. 

Can't the same be said about the government? I mean, come on we've had do-nothing Republican and Democrat Congresses for the past 10 years and we still send them money...

No. We've a do nothing congress and a block and blame congress in the last ten years. Republicans share the common thread in both.

Can't the same be said about the government?

For the republicans "yes"; for most of the Democrats "no".  We need to get rid of the republicans and a few Democrats.  Are you with me?

Yeah, I can go with that. Let's see how the Dems do things for a while. Hopefully we get things accomplished then.

We've had LOTS of legislation passed in the last eight years.

The PATRIOT Act, telecom immunity, etc. Just nothing to help most people.

Baloney.  How many church members from your side are adopting children or working as foster parents? My guess is not many since we have so many abused and neglected children in the system who are not being adopted. Put down your political signs stop yakking and actually Do something for children that are already born and suffering.

Please tell me that this isnt exactly what the Fairness Doctrine was/is for.

Precisely.  Which is why I hope that reinstitutiong the Fairness Doctrine is one of President Obama's first acts.

   Good. That means we won't see the fairness doctrice for at least another 8 years.

As usual, you're wrong again, Phil.  President Obama will be taking to Oath of Office on January 20, 2009.  And I can't wait for his to begin straightening out the mess left by the Bush Misadministration.

   The misadministration needs to be fixed, but uh not uh by uh O'bama.

Talk about goons...

I know it might hurt your brain, but try doing a little research:

This article was taken from the Oregonian, August 20th:                          " It doesn't end there. Last weekend, the Christian Broadcast Network's David Brody asked about the issue. "I hate to say that people are lying," Obama said, "but here's a situation where folks are lying. I have said repeatedly that I would have been completely in, fully in support of the federal bill ... That was not the bill that was presented at the state level."

He called the National Right to Life Committee liars, but they have produced the documents. One is the Illinois "Born Alive" bill Obama opposed, with this neutrality clause: "Nothing in this section shall be construed to affirm, deny, expand, or contract any legal status or legal right applicable to any member of the species homo sapiens at any point prior to being 'born alive' as defined in this section."

Here's the federal clause: "Nothing in this section shall be construed to affirm, deny, expand, or contract any legal status or legal right applicable to any member of the species homo sapiens at any point prior to being 'born alive' as defined in this section."

I'll let others say Obama is lying about his position on the legislation. I won't use Obama's verbiage. It's enough to say that in charging the National Right to Life with lying about his record, Obama was bearing false witness.

Right after the Brody interview aired, the Obama camp admitted to The New York Sun that he had voted against a "Born Alive" bill with the neutrality clause.

Watershed,

For fun, I browse MMFA every now and then to read the comments.  It's been quite awhile since my last time here and I rarely post a comment, but I really think you should not mention the Fairness Doctrine here at the MMFA site. Why? You ask.  Cause where would we find enough conservatives that are willing waste away their days and nights posting petty insults and childish name calling.  If the Fairness Doctrine were to be enforced here at MMFA it would be really boring, because there would only be one comment posted per article.

Day 2 of new right wing lie. I'm taking bets. $10 says it gets two weeks airtime.

As Chevy Chase said in Fletch "Look defenseless babies!! Works every time" This is the level of "commentary" offered by the righty noise machine... I guess they see the Corsi book isn't gaining any traction and this is the next gambit.

Earth to wingnuts,  earth to wingnuts:  If this is needs to be a serious campaign issue, we might  as well  throw in the towel as a nation.  It is a sad commentary on the right wing that they feel our country needs to be concerned with baby killing at this time.  I can see the voters face a real big dilemma right now: The baby killers vs. the baby saviors.  Its a no  brainer in more ways than one.  How could anyone vote to kill babies.  We might as well call off the election.  Whats  the point? 

Bush - who last time I checked was from the pro-life, pro-faith wing of the republican party - has literally bankrupted our country yet this means little when faced with the image of a baby killing Obama. 

 

 

 

 -- It is a sad commentary on the right wing that they feel our country needs to be concerned with baby killing -- EB

 -- The Democratic Party's strong commitment to human rights leads naturally to a pro-life position. Just as we care about the welfare of children, the disabled, and the elderly, we care about unborn children and their mothers. Advocating the killing of a woman's child as a way to solve her problems is inconsistent with the traditional Democratic philosophy -- Democrats for Life for America

If you really cared about the unborn you'd all  be environmentalists!

They are trying to get the pus filled meat sack nascar righties away from their beer and pork rinds long enough to vote for McBushcain. If this one does not fire them up, I think insHANNITY has some "certified-authentic" Limpbahahaha approved documents proving Obama is Sadam's son and Obamas mother is Hillary. I did see a motherly love thing going on in the debates. All that huggin was a tip off. It will be utterly nauseating to see what the right comes up with next and we MUST be watching and listening

Ann Coulter whines about Obama "killing babies", but isn't she among the crowd who cheer the death of babies in Iraq? How did she feel about her colleague Michael Reagan calling for babies to be blown to bits by hand grenades?

Coulter and Limbaugh are argument number 1 for the right to have an abortion.

Coulter and Limbaugh are argument number 1 for the right to have an abortion.

Caulter and Limbaugh are Argument #1 for retroactive abortion......

You owe me $25 for using "RETROACTIVE" birth control.....oops forget it, you said abortion. I came up with RBC 25 years ago and only 5% of people I tell tat to in W. KY. know what the hell it even means even though it is a misnomer. I will say they DO know what baby killing is. It does not matter, it is a red state and I am proud to live (finally) in the land of fast women and beautiful horses and Blue Pot.... I mean grass.

Totally agree: why does nobody ask these goons how they feel about Ali Hussein ?

http://www.thepeoplesvoice.org/cgi-bin/blogs/media/IRAQ_ali_hussein_77.JPG

 

Right.  Doe anybody else but me remember Coulter saying on television that she doesnt care about the civilian casulties in Iraq.  Pro-life indeed. Iraqi citizens did nothing to us.

Doesn't Coulter even realize that with the new FetusTriever™, doctors no longer need to chase the fetuses around the delivery room any more?  Geez, what a moron. 

Eh, the Fetustriever is a fad. As an Ob/Gyn myself (I know, I never mention it) as well as a Colonel, I prefer my "Old School" style.

the new and improved model will catch on. It is a nearly starved to death Komodo dragon. I breed them. It is part of my retroactive birth control research program funded by the military industrial complex department of homeland security. With these suckers, boarder fences will be moot

   Is that a self portrait? I like the shirt, did you buy it yourself or did mommy get it for you?

  Is that a self portrait? No.it's a photo from the internets.

 I like the shirt.   You should go get one. 

did you buy it yourself or did mommy get it for you? Again,It's not really  me, but in case you're concerned,your mommy only buys me booze , and I always make sure she has enough left for your lunch money.

 

"No.it's a photo from the internets."

   There's more than one internet?

Of course. It's a series of tubes. Use the Googles to learn more.

 "Internets" is a Bushism-turned-catchphrase used humorously to portray the speaker as ignorant about the Internet or about technology in general, "

   From wikipedia.   LOL

Typical conservative gotcha politics. Beyond that, they desperately need a wedge issue this year, might as well dust off the abortion issue because the anti-Christ thing failed, they're losing on energy, the economy, immigration, foreign policy, gay marriage and healthcare.

So, let's call Obama a murderer, let's say he loves abortion so much that he kills babies.

Do you con stooges ever, ever, ever get tired of being promised the repeal of Roe v. Wade year after year only to have the rug pulled out from under you every single time?

Wake up.

Republicans love abortion. Nothing rallies the base like the children....unless of course it comes to helping the children that live. Then it's cradle to grave welfare mumbo-jumbo.

Stooges.

Spot on.

Yes, republicans love the children. Some of them a little too much...

Yes, republicans love the children. Some of them a little too much...

Case in point - Former Congressman Mark Foley.

Anotehr case in point - noted Republican and right-wing idiot Ted Nugent.

I thought you were gonna mention pastor ted!

I thought you were gonna mention pastor ted!

Paster Ted hooked up with an adult.  So did Jeff Christie, when he was arrested with that male prostitute in Pittsburgh back in the '70s.  But there's no telling how young the boys were he hooked up with when jeff Christie was caught with Viagra in his luggage after flying back from the Dominican Republic.....

Sexual preferences should be a personal thing EXCEPT when it is when one is extolling the virtues on man / woman marriage and homosexuality is a sin and the "you" go back to your motel room take a Viagra and pull a 12 year old boy from Cambodia out of your luggage. Isn't insHANNITY partying with those guys this weekend? 

 

"So, let's call Obama a murderer, let's say he loves abortion so much that he kills babies."

   Ok. We'll do as you say  The funny thing is that you liberals haven't mentioned the law one time during this thread. Is it because you got so lambasted the last time you tried defending O'bama's position that he approves allowing the killing of live born babies? So, the tactic this time is to show how freindly you liberals are and play on the 'emotion' aspect of the issue? Typical liberals, too predictable.

Oh, God phil. As if you mentioned the law, as if you dip shit cons aren't pulling out all the emotional appeals on this issue. Wake up and take a look at yourself in the mirror.

This is political theatre, there's not a damn sincere bone in LimHanniCoulter's body. This is about turning out the base this year to defeat Obama. Pllain and simple.

   Yes, and it's working. O'bama is dropping in every poll except 'young radical liberals'. And since all 50 of you are registered users of mmfa, it won't get him a ton of votes. Especially the way you constantly try to befriend every conservative out there with the kind words you have for the entire group.

   I hope you don't expect too much from O'bama during this election. When he gets a little more experience and knowledge he should do better in '16.

   Now...use your thumb and first finger, set them at a right angle of each other, put them on your forehead and look in your own mirror!!

You really don't want anything real to register, do you?  You get played for a sucker by these neo-con crooks and liars.  They don't WANT abortions made illegal becaue they use it to get voters like you to pull the lever for them.  But you don't understand that the proposed law in Illinois didn't offer anything new for a viable fetus.  But it did propose that legal action could be taken if a fetus didn't survive through spontaneous abortion (you know what that means I hope)  A bonanza for lawyers, misery for doctors and their patients being second guessed right there in the hospital.

There was already protection for any baby born that is viable.  It was killed in the state house, not the senate, by the way.  Wake up and please stop listening to these paid shills.  They lie to you.

"There was already protection for any baby born that is viable."

   Mary, the law already has protection for "live born" babies. You may want to look THAT up. Big difference between 'live born' and 'viable'. Especially when the only thing that changes viability in a baby is the doctor trying to kill it. 3 seconds before he jabs the knife in it's brain it is a viable baby, afterward...? Well it depends on what quack you used this time.

I love it when people who can't become pregnant, Limbaugh and people who have never been pregnant (Thank God) Coulter, pontificate on abortion.

I think coulter gave birth once. As soon as it popped out it flew out the window and landed on a dog dropping.

COULTER: Yeah, he's for a woman's right to choose through the fourth trimester.

Classic Coulter stupidity.....

what's stupid about it.  it's funny.

Her humor really is great. That's why the half hour comedy hour was such a huge success, right?

it was poorly written.  it just wasn't funny.  she's good at one liners, but you can't sustain a half hour show on that.  but she did not do the writing, so you can't blame her.  i only watched it once and was bored stiff.

Always someone elses fault, it wasn't Anne's fault. Remember to never take responsibility for the fact that conservative humor are two words that have no business residing next to each other in a sentence.

And Henny Youngman sustained a four decade career on one liners. Henny was funny though. See how that works? You have to be funny for humor to work.

Now regale me with one of your tales of when you enjoyed a fine Lobster Thermador with Henny and found him utterly banal and below your level.

It would be an oxymoron for sure. these are some two word phrases that do fit in the republican nomenclature: death penalty, bathroom stall, destroy them,  water gate, war monger, creationism museum, pork rinds, kill them, reality sucks, collateral damage, hali  burton........... I better stop as I don't want to crash the servers

Round, I think you don't understand Annie.  She has worked hard all her life, taking after her mother, apple annie, who sold apples during the depression and became Mary Worth, who meddles in everyone's affairs and stays at other people's homes for indefinite periods. 

Little missy Coulter was abandoned, and instead of selling apples, started peddling "misinformation" for a dollar a pop.  Then Richard Mellon Scaife found her and brought her into his mansion; gave her a big credit card and packed all her steamin' heap o lies into books & articles for mass consumption by the constipated creeps who like idiocy.  So it's not her fault. *

*all facts reported above subject to review. 

what's stupid about it.  it's funny.

The only thing that's funny is that some people in this country actually believe the drek that Ann "The Man" Coulter writes and says.  Her comment about the "fourth trimester" ranks right up there with the pro-life politician in Colorado who said that teen pregnancy rates tend to decrease after age 25.

What is really stupid is that we would vote in a leadership that actually believes this is a real issue.  Also stupid is the idea that at this point in time in our history we have the luxury to even make this a serious issue in our pre election discourse.  Its like fiddling while rome burns.  Yes by all means, save every fetus since we have nothing else to worry about.  Not a thing!

Has there ever been a case where someone wasn't prosecuted for infanticide in the U.S.?

They make it seem as though infanticide or the lack of prosecution for it is a problem in the U.S.

I wonder how Coulter survived her attempted abortion. Maybe they mistook her for the placenta...

I'm not sure where you get the idea that she survived.

I think she might be one of Seance101's Zombie Fetuses.

That might explain her lack of compassion, empathy and reason.

I never considered that.  Could be her personal experience that gives her the unique insight that doctors chase fetuses around the delivery room.

Do I remember seeing a film of her birth?  Seems like I recall her - for lack of a better word - "emerging" from the stomach of what I can only assume was her mother, letting out a high-pitched squeal, and then with strings of saliva dripping from her chin, run out of the delivery room into the dark recesses of the spacecraft.  I did find a picture of the "birth", taken immediately before she sprinted from the delivery room:

She was cuter back then...

With her species, the males sexual organ looks exactly like the newborn infant (in this case coulter). I saw that clip from the delivery room and the reason coulter scampered out of the room so fast is because she had a spot on the insHANNITY radio show. After that spot, she and insHANNITY went out on a date and her first and only child was conceived. (see previous post on her infants delivery. And now flies plague the faucks studios)

And the infanticide attempts.

Actually she was used as chum for great white shark research but the shark regurgitaed her back up and rolled over belly up (the shark). The researchers made coulter swim to shore which poluted the beach  for miles, with a pus/slim substance which killed all kinds of aquatic life.  The researchers then realized she=? is a suitable contributor for faucks news. Now you know the whole story and if insHANNITY can say nonsense is true then so can I but, I believe this is pretty acurate.

This issue has zero traction viability. Just the sound of it, Obama is pro-baby killing, is so fatuous and silly that by comparison it makes the Bigfoot hoax sound plausible.

Randy

I completely agree.  It is so outrageously ridiculous that any reasonable person would consider the source, and the inflammatory rhetoric, and dismiss it immediately.

Of course, there is the small problem that there are hordes of unreasonable or merely unreasoning people out there. If there weren't, we wouldn't be subjected to this nonsense in the first place.

True. Those that reside on the extreme political wing of any ideology, and are only out to demonize those they disagree with, are a sad and prevalent bunch.

"Those that reside on the extreme political wing of any ideology, and are only out to demonize those they disagree with, are a sad and prevalent bunch."

   Now brush your hand over your head and watch how many 'get' that one! Ah ha ha ha, that is truely a classic, Tommy.

Wow.  Did you happen to see either a pot or kettle lying around while you missed Tommy's point?

I don't think Philib does a whole lot of "seeing".

   Oh, I got Tommy's point.

"I don't think Philib does a whole lot of "seeing". "

  No, not for quite a few years.

Nah, they are running with this one. They've upped the abortion ante to "baby-killer" and seeing how it sticks. You can practically OBSERVE the talking point come down the pike, whoever thought it up, to Limbaugh, to Hannity, to the ever awful Coulter, etc.

I don't care what rhetoric they use, it will only appease the visceral pro-lifers.....the rest of us will see it for what it is, dumb.

I respect those that are pro-life and their positions, but I am frankly tired of their whining on this.  Every election they make this some litmus test saying they will bolt the Republican party if they even dare nominate someone who is not strict pro-life.  And nothing ever changes.  Roe v Wade will not be overturned, abortion will never be illegal, and the issue stagnates into obscurity after each election.  The johnny one noters on this issue bore me. 

Roe vs. Wade = A bunch of lawyers getting bored in DC.

"The johnny one noters on this issue bore me. "

   That may because you seem to have ignored (or forgotten) what this issue is about. This issue is about babies that don't die the first time they try to kill it, are born alive then the doctor wants to finish killing it outside the womb. The current law states that the other doctor present (at every abortion in Illinois) is supposed to perform life saving procedures in an attempt to save the baby's life. O'bama is against this requirement and feels it is OK to just kill this live born baby outside the womb. If that is an option according to his (and the liberals here) interpretation of the law, why even bother offering PBA's? Just deliver the baby then kill it, no fuss-no muss and no danger to the mother. So, answer for me, please, why don't they just kill the baby outside the womb? 

 Recheck the headlines of this thread. The 'generic' abortion issue is, I agree, worn out. This isn't about the generic abortion issue.

 

If he's pro-choice/pro-abortion he's pro-baby killing. I mean 2+2=4 how much further can I break this down?

You can break it all the way down to the ankles you're grabbing. I'll give you credit for persistence, but none for your pathetic attempts at debate and argumentation. I've been away from the board for a while, but I can easily see that you are nothing more than a sad, parroting echo of the figures that MMFA critiques. Creepy.

However, this isn't a right vs. left issue, it's right vs. wrong. There's a big difference there. If it was a right vs. left issue, I would admit to that accusation and apologize and stand corrected.

You're trying to do what they call "framing." Well guess what, I don't accept YOUR frame. This right vs. wrong gambit is nonsense. People have to approach complex issues with open minds. You throw out such simplistic slogans "2+2=4" "right vs. wrong" blah blah blah. Let me guess, you're a Liberty University graduate who wasn't well connected enough to get a job as a unqualified political appointee at government agency, so now you're trying to build a resume disrupting authentic debate on this site. Like I said before, creepy.

People have to approach complex issues with open minds.

 

I agree but this isn't a complex issue.

Actually, it is but you don't have an open mind. Or a functioning mind. Twit. And yes, given all the drivel I've witnessed from you, I'm perfectly content to call you out.

So what's difficult to understand about the fact that abortion is murder?

DaWuss,

When fertility clinics rid themselves of embryoes that they are not using, are they committing murder as well?

fried, when fertility clinics gather those cells, are they committing rape?

Again with the framing. You're a one-trick pony. All you've managed to demonstrate is a shaky grasp of basic arithmetic and bare understanding of monosyllabic word arrangement. Murder assumes life begins at conception. I don't assume that. You do. Is it murder kill thousands of people in a war based on falsehoods and deception? I'll bet you don't assume that. Next.

Murder assumes life begins at conception. I don't assume that. You do.

 

I don't assume fact.

Thanks for demonstrating an open mind. Assuming life begins at conception has NEVER been proven as "fact." There have been philosophical and rhetorical arguments on both sides. What IS a fact is that a fetus has no viability outside of the mother's body. The same body that you would deny its owner control of. And you didn't answer the question about the killing of thousands in a war that was started as a result of falsehoods and deception. Creepy and sad.

So what's difficult to understand about the fact that abortion is murder?

Where did you get that silly notion?

Exact: it a very simple one. If abortion is forbidden and illegal, it WILL be done in clandestine butchery clinics with no safety whatsoever, without counseling that may present alternative solutions and with a very high level of mortality (as it was the case a century ago). But maybe this what you want as the proper punishment for "these sluts"... On a public policy point of view, legal abortion IS A MORAL OBLIGATION. And it allows you to do what you think is the right thing to do following your personal feelings or beliefs.

And once those places are found the people running them will be thrown in prison for murder and their assets will be seized.

And it will as effectvely stop abortion to be performed as it stopped rape, common murder, drug trafficking, illegal immigration, Al Qaeda terrorists or bank robbery... I'd laugh if it wasn't so sad.

"On a public policy point of view, legal abortion IS A MORAL OBLIGATION."

 

Since WTF is abortion A MORAL OBLIGATION??? That's just as ridiculous as saying that the Oakland Raiders are going to win the Super Bowl.

 

... and you people think I make assinine comments...

In every civilized countries, legal, safe, and affordable abortion is considered a MORAL OBLIGATION FOR THE STATE. It has nothing to do with your own personal feelings or beliefs. You can still think or believe that abortion is a barbaric disgusting horrible and gruesome sin on a personal level. But as a stateperson, as a politician, a) you cannot impose this view on your people, b) knowing the disgusting horrible and gruesome consequences it will bring on all these women having an abortion.

By the way, I live in Colombia were abortion is illegal (except for very specific medical or incest or rape cases since 2007), and hundred of thousands illegal abortion are performed, and hundreds of women die because of it each year. In France, since it has been legalized 40 years ago, the number of abortions stayed about the same as the population doubled (by the way here the teen pregancy rate is ten times lower than in the US).

Grow up is the only advice I have to you.

So I can't impose my view that murder is wrong the next time a homicide occurs. Why the murderer is just exercising his freedoms as an individual! Gee, that makes perfect sense, let's just throw human rights out the window because a murderer should be allowed to do whatever he wants to the victim...

Punishig murder is PUBLIC ORDER matter and not a moral one for the legal system of a country. But it is in its MORAL OBLIGATION to protect PUBLIC ORDER. And havign legal, safe and affordable abortion clinics is a better PUBLIC ORDER policy than to have clandestine butchers shops. 

Punishig murder is PUBLIC ORDER matter and not a moral one for the legal system of a country. But it is in its MORAL OBLIGATION to protect PUBLIC ORDER. And havign legal, safe and affordable abortion clinics is a better PUBLIC ORDER policy than to have clandestine butchers shops.

So it's still morally acceptable to murder someone, based upon the premise of that statement...

 

See, a baby, whether it's born or unborn, is a human being, and as such has human rights, which includes a right to life. Killing someone inside the womb is no different than killing someone outside of it.

Problem is: abortion IS NOT MURDER as defined by the legal system of your country. It is as defined by your own personal religious beliefs as teached by your priest/pastor/rabbi/imam. But your country (and mine by the way) is a secular one. End of debate on a PUBLIC POLICY point of view, because a secular country will never consider abortion a murder, balancing the PUBLIC ORDER pros and cons of this definition.

By the way, if you consider that abortion is a murder, i'd like to know your opinion about the death penalty and the death of Ali Hussein.

Death penalty? Unlike abortion, that is a complex subject - I don't wanna kill him, I don't wanna' take care of him, and I sure as heck don't wanna' release him. So what do I do?

DaWuss,

So, if abortion is murder, and it becomes illegal, are you calling for every fetus to be registered as born as soon as the pregnancy is realized?  Also, will you want to investigate every miscarriage.  After all, if a woman loses her baby, maybe she did it on purpose, right?

fried, what would be the penalty for your idea of charging abortionists with murder? What charge would you level against the woman who miscarries? And, what penalty would you demand of her?

And what will you do with the women who actively seek out abortions?  How much time should they do?

I do have some questions for you: 

If the law is changed to reflect your beliefs (a la the Colorado ballot initiative), as a woman, do I always get to ride in the carpool lane?  After all, I might be pregnant with an unverifiable fertilized egg in there somewhere.  (In case you didn't know, pregnancies can only be detected once the egg attaches itself to the uterine lining and the female body starts the work of developing the pregnancy)

• Do I have to send my used pads and tampons to the government, to verified that a "person"/fertilized egg didn't just wash out with my period (about 50% of fertilized eggs naturally fail to implant)
• Does the government get to have a say over my eating and drinking habits?  After all, I might be pregnant with a "person."
• Do I get to claim 6 dependents on my tax returns?  After all, given the rate at which "people"/fertilized eggs fail to implant, I likely had six "children" during the course of the year and am thus entitled to the tax breaks.

I'd get into the actual arguments for abortion with you, but you seem to be peculiarly resistant to any sort of logical argument that doesn't focus on ZOMG!!! Teh Baaaaaybeeees!

Hmm, the formatting did not work at all.  Anyway, the commetn addresses the idea of the law conforming the DaWuss's views that a person with legal rights is created at the moment of conception.

Froggyreader posted:

(by the way here the teen pregancy rate is ten times lower than in the US).

Why do you think this is Froggy?  

The french policy on birth control is very simple: the sexual education is entirely focused on teaching the risks of having unprotected and/or without birth control sex (both physical and psychological), but do not impose any moral point of view on the act itself. If you're a teenager girl, you can have, without parental autorisation or even knowledge, free access to any birth control and even "plan b pill" you may need. Just go into your high school pharmacy and ask for it. Just go to any doctor and ask for a prescription. No questions asked except for strictly medical purpose, no moral judgement, no signaling to anyone. 

But don't try to amalgamate contraception with abortion - those are two entirely different subjects

Like it or not, people like simplicity.  In the case with Dawuss' frame, the wrong would be the people who want to force women to carry something in their body for nine months that they may not want to carry.

If he's pro-choice/pro-abortion he's pro-baby killing. I mean 2+2=4 how much further can I break this down?

You can't breakdown a stupid statement.

Pro-choice means a woman's right to control her own body. "Pro- baby killing" is the lunatic fringe creating new code words to same the same stupid crap they've been saying, "we want to control women's bodies".

Do you want the public deciding if men should have those pills that make it possible for you to make a baby?  Because if that's the case, we need to take those blue pills off the market, some folks should NEVER be allowed to re-produce.

 -- some folks should NEVER be allowed to re-produce. -- pearlene

That's pretty straight forward...unless you're just knocking men.

Does your belief include denying a woman...that you feel unfit for motherhood...the right to control her own body by having a child?

Just curious. 

 

That's pretty straight forward...unless you're just knocking men.

Wes, it's as straight forwards as it sounds. Do men want the public deciding whether they should have access to those little blue pills? The answer is no, because men can use those little blue pills for more than making babies and THAT is the point. Giving life to a baby is something only a woman can provide and it should be her decision, if she wants to proceed with her pregnancy or terminate it. 

Does your belief include denying a woman...that you feel unfit for motherhood...the right to control her own body by having a child?

Just curious. 

I may think some folks shouldn't reproduce, but I don't have the right to determine who does what with their bodies. I also THINK some folks should have never been given a license to drive. :-)  

Your logic is ridiculous.

You say you are pro-choice?  What choice is that?  You want a woman to be free to choose what?  To kill her baby?

Do I want  for the government to able to tell the woman that she can not choose to kill her baby?  You're darn right I do!

The pro-"choice" arguement is a canard.  A woman makes her choice when she chooses to have sex.  This is a matter of not wanting to deal with the consequences of that decision.  Choosing to have sex can result in consequences.  The pro-"choice" crowd simply does not believe in accepting the consequences of one's decisions.

If I have my finger on the trigger of a gun, the finger is part of my body, is it not?  Who are you to tell me what I can and can not do with my finger (it is part of my body)?  I can do whatever I want with my finger (on the trigger) but there are consequences associated with the decision I make.

 

Personally opposed?  Another canard.  Here is your logic: 

"I am personally opposed to sending people to the gas chambers of Auschwitz.  I would never do it myself.  I find the practice objectionable.  But who am I to tell other people what to do?  I am imposing my values on the Nazis by telling them they can't gas people.  Even though I don't like it, it is not the position of government to tell people what they can and can't do.  If they want to gas people, that is their choice.

I'm pro choice, and if you dont want an abortion, dont have one. that's your choice.

If you're pro choice, please, visit a Catholic priest the next time you're considering an abortion.

 

(There, talk to someone who isn't a right winger but still respects the life of an unborn baby)

Yeah, talk to someone who sprinkles water on a baby's head so that it will be possible for it to be admitted to heaven when it dies.  Talk to someone who consumes wine and crackers considered to be the blood and bones of (what we assume was) a man who supposedly rose from the dead.  Talk to someone who eats Lobster bisque on Fridays in order to "fast" to honor the crucifixion of that same man.  Talk to someone who does all these things because he has been instructed that one interpretation of several word-of-mouth stories in a 2000 year-old book tells him to.

If you want to know the reality of abortion, talk to someone like that.

You mean the same catholic church who pushed women to become baby factories so they could outbreed other religions? That catholic church?

I've tried to rationalise what it is about you and your comments that cause me to reply time after time. At first l thought it was just the incredibly stupid, repetitive and juvenile Obamassiah matra you kept spouting, but that wasn't it. Then i thought it was the faceitous little comments you would post or your obvious trolling to derail threads with some stupid rightwing talking points or your incredibly sad see through attempts to pretend to be a progressive but none of those were the reason. It wasn't until this tread that l realised what it was. The simple fact is that you sir, are a git. This site is full of people who raise the level of debate and, while it has trolls and those who use strawmmen, l can actually use it as a reference when ignorate people on this side of the pond call all residents of the USA uninformed on world events or stupid. You just drag things down. it's just my opinion, take ie as you will.

If he's pro choice.....

Show me on your birth certificate that you have the right to decide what someone else believes. Life, liberty and the persuit of happiness....,To thine own self be true, Live and let live, to each his own............You could work on a law to get condoms made illegal. I will send you the paper.

 

 

And while we're on abortion will they discuss John McCain's stand on fetalicide?

And while we're on abortion will they discuss John McCain's stand on fetalicide?

Depends on which day they ask him about it. Monday's answer will definitely be different from Tuesday's. "Stand" and McCain don't go together.

Would this be something that factcheck.org would cover?

He stood opposed to a bill that would have protected children born alive during an abortion. You are defending that from a man who does know when human rights are inferred on a baby?

"Above my paygrade!"

HANNITY, COULTER, AND LIMBAUGH= the new version of LARRY, MOE, AND CURRLY. Anybody that believes  these three stooges will get what they deserve, four more years of REPUBLICAN rule.