This is just ridiculous. So McCain finally rejects this nut's endorsement, but of course that is not enough for MMFA, who wants to keep this slime by association alive until its very last breath is drawn.

So keep pumping on the breathless chest of this association for as long as you can MMFA, and then remind us again about how your mission of conservative misinformation has morphed into this.

You miss the point, Tommy... FOX would not even tell its viwers why McCain was finally forced to reject Hagee's endorsement. If I am reading this correctly, they didn't even mention Hagee's Hitler remarks.

I didn't miss the point, of course MMFA wants every hideous remark made by Hagee out there.  That is the point.

Hagee isn't running for president.

Tommy, the only problem is Fox has been playing the Rev Wright non stop. I agree Haage should not matter, and I could care less about him and his relationship with McCain, but this is a clear example of Fox again playing two sides.

I disagree. It is merely a clear example of Fox's support for the candidacy of John McCain.  There is no double standard if you realize Fox is simply a propoganda tool. 

But then again: Is there not the possibility for where the Religiopolitical Right might seek out a third-party Presidential candidate for to support in line with their support of "defending Traditional Christian Moral and Familial Values"?

Let alone simply boycotting the November elections outright as a show of protest?

The point, Tommy, is that FOX is selling misinformation. McCain rejected Hagee's endorsement as a result of Hagee's Hitler remarks, not his ant-Catholic remarks as Cavuto suggested. How many FOX viewers do you think even know about Hagee's Hitler remarks? Did FOX forget to mention Hagee's Hitler remarks or were they insulating McCain from any association with Hagee's lunacy. McCain actively sought Hagee's endorsement. What does that say about McCain's judgment regardless whether it is now politically expedient to throw Hagee under the bus.

TOMMY, Nobody thinks Hagee is running for president, OK? And not only did Cavuto fail to tell his viewers the real reason for McCain repudiating the Hagee endorsement he had sought (Hagee's comments that Hitler was doing God's will in conducting the Holocaust), the reason Cavuto did give -- Hagee's anti-Catholic bigotry -- could not have been the reason since Hagee had apologized for and completely renounced his anti-Catholic remarks in a May 12 letter to William Donohue's Catholic League. I guess Cavuto missed that one.

I think we're ALL missing the point, here.  What Hagee believes and has said is exactly what evangelicals believe.  God sending Hilter (among other supernatural evils) to afflict the Jews, the upcoming "Ezekiel's War" episode, the Catholic Church being the great whore, all that bullsh!t, is evangelical dogma, not "lunatic fringe" ramblings, heard in churches across the coountry every single day.  This is only McCain's "pastor problem" to those of us don't believe what Hagee is saying, but to the majority of evangelicals, what he is saying is God's honest truth.  In the uni-mind of evangelical America, this is not guilt by association, but, rather, a very valuable imprimatur.  Just something to think about... The more we harp on the pastor Hagee/McCain connection as being wrong or bad or embarrassing, the more we "fulfill prophecy" in their eyes.  Witness, even, how soft and underreported Hagess's "apology" for his remarks was.  This is proof of a Jellicle bias in the media.  If we really took a deeper look at the Evangelical church, much like Hannity exhorts America to take a deeper look at the Black Church, we might find some interesting things.  I would argue that the former is more dangerous than the latter based simply on the former's desire to bring the world to an end by, now, affecting national poilitcs in a way that would hasten the return of Jesus the Christ and the destruction of the world.  I'm just saying... This is McCain's pastor problem.  We should just leave it alone or play into the evangelical persecution mania.

If we really took a deeper look at the Evangelical church, much like Hannity exhorts America to take a deeper look at the Black Church, we might find some interesting things. 

You nailed it there...EXCELLENT point!

Next time the Evangelical party is running against the Black church party for public office, then it's relevant, until that time it's best left for theological discussions.

Tommy, do you seriously believe that Sean Hannity and others at FOX are going to stop talking about Jeremiah Wright? All we're asking for is balance. FOX needs to either stop harping about Wright or give both sides. Fair and balanced, right...?

You know, I don't know about you guys but i have handled my share of poisonous snakes, but....

"All we're asking for is balance. FOX needs to either stop harping about Wright or give both sides. Fair and balanced, right...?"

   NO, you are demanding it! Fox is not required to stop anything. Mmfa is not required to stop anything. When mmfa starts giving "both sides" of the issue then you will have a point. Fox is a business, not a public service. Just like mmfa...a business, not a public service. You can stop your hypocritical whining about "fairness" when you start whining about unequal treatment of the right-wing at mmfa. Until that happens you are just another whiner with an attitude. Which, in case you don't realize it, makes you a liberal.

Excellent post, phullofbubbles... I'm glad you pointed out that Fox SAYS they are 'fair and balanced' when they definitely are NOT while MMFA SAYS they are commited to exposing conservative misinformation which they definitely DO.  Did you wake up on the wrong side of the rock this morning?  You seem a little testy and your logic is a bit low- even for you.

Sorry Phliiber- you can cop an attitude and whine all you want. Just because you think that makes you a liberal doesn't make it true. Get rid of the bad attitude and stop whining, and you might be on the path to liberalism. Until then , you're just a whiny, bad attitude Con.

Philib, are you really that ignorant or just pretending not to know the difference bewteen a cable news network which professes to report the news in a "fair and balanced" (which all news channels should do anyway without crowing about it) and a web site whose stated reason for being is to expose conservative media misinformation?

   I don't think twisting meanings and selective quoting is the same as exposing missinformation. 

   'Fair + balanced' is dependant on your point of view. Those who like the show, probably think it is. Those who don't will not. Similar to mmfa, those who like it think it's the best thing since buttered bread, those who don't think it's simply a site where whiners gather to whine about anything they can create that sounds reasonable to them.

'DependEnt on your view'... are you serious?  It's pretty easy to quantify fair and balanced (from here on out, called 'f-n-b' or f-ing b)- for each *news* show on fox that is conservative, BALANCE it with a liberal show or commentators.  For each lie they spread, they are UNFAIR, and they say many lies. 

Sure, people who may like the *news* network may THINK it's f-ing b, but that doesn't make it so.  News reporting should be pretty much objective, and those throwing out their opinions should be able to back up their assertions with FACTS, not lies, smears, racist and sexist remarks, etc. 

By the way, your thinking that those on this site are mostly whiners is waaaaay off base.  Most of us here just want to be able to watch and read the news WITHOUT having to go to 15 other sources to verify that what was said is the truth BECAUSE the media has been so damn complicit in NOT being factual, truthful, or honest in MANY instances.  I'm glad MMFA is here to point the spotlight on all the bs that comes from our main *news* outlets.    

"What Hagee believes and has said is exactly what evangelicals believe. "

What a bunch of CRAP the church I have attended for 43 years has never once stated these views.  Pull your head out of the blogs and see the real world...you really think your local church teaches/says these things?

Tommy,

Had you not been consistent in opposing this guilt by association concerning Wright, I'd say you were being phony.

However, didn't you find Cavuto's implication that Obama has a Jeremiah Wright problem just as insidious as you claim MMFA to be?

Yes, absolutely.

But, Tommy, with all due respect, you sound as though you are defending FOX when you bash MMFA in an instance like this. Call it like it is...FOX is trying to shield McCain by spreading half-truths and misinformation.

I don't defend either, MMFA has a very clear agenda, as does Fox.  If Fox, or anyone, wants to cover this rejection by McCain, then fine - that may be newsworthy, but to insist that more of Hagee's remarks get airplay has nothing do with exposing misinformation, you can believe that, I don't.

But, Tommy, you bashed MMFA (rightly or wrongly) and yet you did not likewise condemn FOX.

I would agree that from time to time MMFA runs pieces which are not exactly consistent with its mission statement. However, in this instance MMFA is right on the mark. Cavuto's piece is a perfect example of the misinformation spread by FOX.

No, I never condemn Fox.  I think they are perfect in every way.  Happy? 

My happiness is irrelevant...as I am sure my children would agree.  ;>)

Nvertheless, I am simply pointing out that in this instance you did not condemn FOX for balatantly misrepresenting the circumstances of McCain's rejection of Hagee...you bashed MMFA exclusively instead.

As I said, they reported McCain's rejection, for me that is enough.  There was no reason to go back to more of Hagee's nuttiness, and I know you can't get enough of it as you have made your opinion of McCain quite clear here.  I am not a McCain fan either, I have no plans on voting for him - but I am sick of this pastoral crap infiltrating these campaigns, and I still maintain that when all is said and done Obama is far more vulnerable than McCain is, for reasons I have explained here plenty.  So I would like to focus on issues and the future - unlike some who just live and breathe trashing the one they don't like.

“Obviously, I find these remarks and others deeply offensive and indefensible, and I repudiate them,” McCain said in a statement Thursday. “I did not know of them before Reverend Hagee’s endorsement, and I feel I must reject his endorsement as well.”

They did not report McCain's words in rejecting Hagee, nor "these remarks" for why he did so.  Why did they report Obama's specific rejection and Wright's comments that led to it?

I have no idea.   Wright's nutty comments are as irrelevant to me as Hagee's.  So I am not the one to ask.

Ok, but this is a website of an organization that does ask and will continue to spotlight what is misinformation delivered by MSM.  The "issue" here is media misinformation, not the "issues" pertaining to an election year.

Tommy- MMFA is angry as are many partisans that McCain has renounced that nut, so they will do whatever they can to keep this alive. These people hate McCain and will do whatever it takes to make him look worse than he is. That means lie, distort or make stories up that are just not important to the American people. Americans want to know about Gas Prices, food, houses and the war. Not about nutty Revs and insane and irrelevant loans.  Shame on us.

Oh no Bob, it's all about the media misinformation and the hunt for the truth, fair and accurate.  There is no political agenda in sliming McCain, where on earth.............

There is a political agenda.  No one claimed otherwise.

That means lie, distort or make stories up that are just not important to the American people.

Uhhh...what exactly are the lies, distortions and made up stories about McCain of which you speak?

The lie is that he agrees with Rev Nutjob, He has denounced him, lets move on and discuss real issues. $5 gas? 

Do you seriously think that Sean Hannity and others at FOX are going to stop harping about Jeremiah Wright and move on? Ha...yea, right!

Hannity and FOX are scum, does that mean MMFA needs to get in the gutter with these people?

How exactly is MMFA spreading misinformation the way FOX is doing?

Did I say that? You brought up FOX not me.

Uhhh...this entire thread is about the way FOX is shielding McCain. Some of you are trying to take it elsewhere.

Yes it is , but not in the context you claimed I brought it up as.

Oh, please...

Oh Please you.

An eye for an eye.  The stakes are too high.  As Cheney once famously said, its fair game.

Hannity and FOX are scum, does that mean MMFA needs to get in the gutter with these people?

• - BobtheP / Friday May 23, 2008 1:03:17 PM EDT

So, Bobthep says that Media Matters is getting into the gutter, and doing similar bad things compared to Fox.

How exactly is MMFA spreading misinformation the way FOX is doing?

• - IRONY 101 / Friday May 23, 2008 1:05:38 PM EDT

Did I say that? You brought up FOX not me.

• - BobtheP / Friday May 23, 2008 1:08:56 PM EDT

Yes, you did say that, and this thread is about Fox and their misdeeds.

It would be amazing how similar this sounds to a Sueeld argument about the trash-talking she does about Keith Olbermann if it weren't for the fact that Bobthep and Sueeld are the same poster with different screen names.

BTW, no one is saying McCain AGREES with Rev. Nutjob's remarks. We are saying that McCain is an opportunistic fraud for soliciting Hagee's endorsement for political gain and, further, that FOX News is distorting the circumstances of Hagee's endorsement and of McCain's subsequent rejection of it. Now, where are the lies, distortions and made up stories about McCain of which you speak?

But McCain has denounced it , so lets move on. Fraud? I do not agree with McCain politically but anyone who withstands 5 1/2 years of torture deserves more respect than MMFA or people like you give him. Sad.

McCain has EARNED my disapproval and that of every other American who has paid attention to his ambitious and opportunistic grab for the presidency. Even an honorable POW can turn into a common, garden variety politician who will say or do anything to gain office.

"BTW, no one is saying McCain AGREES with Rev. Nutjob's remarks. We are saying that McCain is an opportunistic fraud for soliciting Hagee's endorsement for political gain and, further, that FOX News is distorting the circumstances of Hagee's endorsement and of McCain's subsequent rejection of it."

   And no one is saying Obama AGREES with Rev Racist's remarks. We are saying that Obama is an opportunistic fraud for befriending Wright for political gain, and further, that mmfa is distorting the circumstances of Wright's teachings and of Obama's subsequent denial of it.

Soliciting is very different from being friends with.  McCain SOUGHT OUT Hagee's endoresement while knowing full well Hagee's contempt for others not like him while Obama did NOT seek out any endoresement from Wright. 

Obama is an opportunistic fraud for befriending Wright for political gain

That's a stupid comment even for you.

And no one is saying Obama AGREES with Rev Racist's remarks.

Ha...you can't be serious! That's EXACTLY what the right wing wants it dumb as dirt followers to believe...that is, those who don't believe Obama is a Muslim.

TOMMY, why are you trying to take this thread off-topic? Are you a troll? MMFA is simply pointing out Cavuto's misinformation. Why can't you see that? Of course, I can undertstand why you would be bothered to see Hagee's remarkes reported in full, since McCain actively sought out Hagee's endorsement. Not such great judgment on McCain's part, was it?

 

Tommy is a "Why is this here?" troll.  Nothing to see behind the curtain because I'm smart and can see through the spin" kind of troll.

I agree with you Thomas, but for a different reason: Hagee's comments  don't need to be replayed on a "revwright-loop" because Fox viewers hear Hagee's remarks every weekend (and sometimes daily) in church.  Hagee's comments are jellicle dogma.

BR,

Funny juxtaposition with jellicle and dogma even if it doesn't make a lot of sense. :-) I'm surprised you don't have a bone to pick with Karl Rove or someone else in that category. 

By "jellicle", I mean evanGELICAL.  The mash-up was unintentional, but I'm glad you liked it.    

Incredible...it must be wonderful living in an alternate reality of darkness and ignorance where FOX news shields you from any unpleasant facts which may cause you to question your ideology.

Actually, you could look at this from another angle which is not so kind to McCain.  Considering how most of Fox viewers are Republican rightwingers, they see that by McCain rejecting Hagee's endorsement without explicitly saying why could lead many of those religious "fanatacal rightwingers" to take Hagee's side not knowing about his Hitler comments, and be rather upset at McCain.

If Cavuto had told them the details of Hagee's remarks they might be more sympathetic to McCain and understand his rejection as being justified. 

I think FOX is simply trying to make this a non-story so it will go away...and then they can get back to bashing Obama.

And it should go away. McCain has rejected the guy's endorsement and Hagee has withdrawn it, would it be so awful to now move beyond this pastoral tit for tat silliness and address real issues facing our country?

I know the slimers from both sides have no interest in that debate, but I don't have to lie down with them. 

Tommy, it's still news when McCain is forced to reject Hagee's endorsement. FOX won't even tell the truth about it though. That's the point here.

Irony,

I think this whole ordeal McCain stepped into by courting the endorsement also contradicts McCain's maverick status. He's an obvious sellout to the radical base of the Republican party. His subsequent renouncement of Hagee is just another indication of his any way the wind blows lust for the presidency.

He reminds me of Gollum; twisted and deformed by his ambition for power.

That's what I've been saying...and will continue to say. McCain is so ambitious he will do or say anything to be president. This episode is just another example that McCain is a FRAUD...

Yes, you have been saying it, as have many, many people. I just wanted to join the chorus.

Welcome, Round... ;>)

They could be covering their bases, Tommy. The Fox viewers are pretty well conditioned to hear what they want to hear. Maybe Fox hasn't done enough research to determine if they have a larger number of Catholics or Nazis in their demographic, and are hoping each group will assume the denouncement applies to the statements that work out best for them personally.

Actually, TOMMY, Cavuto did tell viewers about Hagee's anti-Catholic comments (if not in precise detail). Apparently, Cavuto wanted viewers to think those anti-Catholic comments were the reason for McCain's repudiation of Hagee. (Apparently, McCain was willing to risk being considered if not sympathetic to anti-Catholic remarks, certainly insensitive to anti-Catholic bigotry.) If some of Hagee's followers are anti-Catholic bigots, perhaps they were angered to hear McCain repudiate Hagee. But they might have been heartened that it had taken this long to happen.

Fox News can't get its story straight.  On TV they report that McCain rejected Hagee's endorsement due to his anti-Catholic beliefs and on-line Fox News reports that he rejected the endorsement because of comments Hagee made about the Nazis.

I don't find Cavuto's disingenuousness surprising; that's to be expected.

What I find surprising is that Cavuto reported on a wildfire in Santa Cruz and didn't gloat about liberals losing their expensive homes. MMFA never talks about it when Faux anchors do something RIGHT, do they Tommy?

The entire MSM seems to be ignoring the fact that Granps actively sought Hagee's endorsement. To leave that out IS misinformation by omission. This is not just some random nutcase who came out for McCain; his endorsement was a carefully crafted part of McCain's strategy for winning the Republican primary. Now that Gramps has that in his pocket, he's perfectly willing to throw Hagee overboard. Admirable!

Exactly...

...and I find it difficult to believe that McCain knew nothing about Hagee's or Parsley's controversial (nutty) statements. What, McCain's people don't research these guys beforehand? More likely, the value of their endorsements at the time outweighed the fallout later at which time McCain could bail out on these guys. McCain used these guys to get what he wanted...

Possibly, a few of the fundamentalists will realize that, ONCE AGAIN, they were used and then discarded by the powers-that-be in the Republican Party.

That's a risk McCain took. But the election is not until November and it will be interesting to see what he does to bring the religious people he might have alienated back into the fold. IMO the game plan will involve selling Obama as dangerously secular.

That would be something. Does anyone in either party honestly believe that religion/spiritual beliefs are an important factor in McCain's life? (And it wouldn't bother me in the least if that were true.) But he certainly comes across as dishonest when he attempts to present himself as a man of faith.

Ha... every politician loves Jesus at election time, especially Republicans. ;>)

Ha... every politician loves Jesus at election time, especially Republicans. ;>)

Actually, it's pretty easy to see how Gramps got hooked up with this looser. Early in the primary season, he went shopping for an evangelist but found that all the expensive Walmart products (Falwell, Robertson, Dobson) had already been bought, so he had to go down the street to the Dollar Store and found Hagee sitting on the shelf. With almost no staff at that point, he couldn't do the appropriate research and got stuck with a lemon. Buyer's remorse!

He had Falwell, but Falwell up and died on him. How inconsiderate...uhhh, I mean inconsiderate.  ;>)

I meant to say inconvenient... <poor proof reading>  ;>)

irony wrote: ...and I find it difficult to believe that McCain knew nothing about Hagee's or Parsley's controversial (nutty) statements.

Is the same guy who defended Obama not knowing what his own Pastor shouted from the pulpit?   

...and I find it difficult to believe that McCain knew nothing about Hagee's or Parsley's controversial (nutty) statements.

Just like many folks find it difficult to believe that Obama wasn't aware of most of Rev. Wright's  controversial [nutty] statements, yet remained a parishioner & friend to Wright.

But that aside, Cavuto seems to have deliberately omitted 2 important pieces of information. Personally I'm sick to death of all these so called men of God. None of the 3 [Hagee, Parsley, or Wright] deserve that title.

The difference is that Sean Hannity had to dig up Jeremiah Wright and make him relevant. John McCain courted Hagee and Parsley for political gain.

Dig him up or not it doesn't change the fact that Obama was likely aware of the controversial remarks but chose to remain a parishioner, a friend & has referred to Wright as his mentor.

I don't believe McCain or Obama get a pass here.

Well, uhhh...the gist of this thread is that FOX is blatantly trying to give McCain a pass on this one while they have hammered Obama. That's how I see it.

Irony,

Did you even read the MMFA thread?  How then did it escape your notice that Cavuto's clip mentioned Hagee's offensive remarks against Catholics?  

A complete pass?  I think you fumbled on this one. :-)  

I think not, AA... McCain gave Hagee a pass on his anti-Catholic statements. It was Hagee's Hitler statements that caused McCain to reject Hagee's endorsement. FOX gave Hagee and McCain a pass by omitting Hagee's outrageous Hitler comments from their report...a minor point, I'm sure.

Again it must have slipped your notice. Hagee apologized to Catholics. McCain accepted the apology.  

It sounds like you aren't familiar with the newly discovered, disgusting statements by Hagee that Hitler was sent by God to kill Jews and herd the rest to Palestine.  That is what everybody else is talking about and what Cavuto decided not to mention.

jaw,

You must have missed the fact I was replying to Irony's statement immediately above mine.

Yes I am familiar with Haggee's newly released statements.  His pronouncements and interpretations of world events as though he were an Old Testament prophet  have shown him to be of the same mold as Rev. Wright.

 

Hagee is not in the same mold as Wright in the slightest.

Wright has had 20 seconds of sermons cherry-picked out of over 30 years of sermons.

Every word out of Hagee's mouth is wackoism at it's lowest. 

Just trying to help.  I did read the whole back-and-forth and your comments were a bit confusing.  I truly didn't know if you were aware of them.  

That said, I think it is beyond silly to pretend that Hagee's statements that Hitler was sent by God to kill Jews and send the rest to Palestine in order for them to eventually be killed by Jesus are in the same ballpark as Wright.  To quote the esteemed Jules Winnfield, "Ain't no f**king ballpark...it ain't the same league, it ain't even the same f**king sport."

I would love to see how you can take that quote from Hagee and find a quote from Wright that is in the same ballpark. 

Let me stipulate that I don't agree with either of the men.

What is apparent is that they take upon themselves to interpret scripture and apply their particular interpretations to current events in order to advance their particular agendas.   

We know the difference is that one candidate has a deep and personal history going back 20 years with his Pastor and the other sought out an endorsement. 

I agree completely with what you wrote.  Where I seem to disagree with you is in the fact that what Hagee said is immeasurably worse (and crazier on the religious nutjob scale) that what Wright has said.  Therefore, if you multiply the disgustingness of the preacher with the level of closeness to the candidate, the McCain-Hagee number is worse than the Obama-Wright number in my opinion.  

Jaw,

I respectfully disagree. Accusing the U.S. Government of creating the Aids virus to wipe out blacks is a lot more outlandish in my book than saying God works in mysterious ways. However we're simply quibbling. Both Pastors went off the deep end. 

Accusing the U.S. Government of creating the Aids virus to wipe out blacks is a lot more outlandish in my book than saying God works in mysterious ways.

And you find NOTHING outrageous about Hitler being sent by God to send the Jew back to Israel?

The other difference (and it's just my opinion, as even some of the more liberal posters here have made it clear that they consider Wright "hateful", "divisive", etc.)is that while Wright's wrath is generally directed at the power structure, the government, America as a whole acknowledging its past sins, Hagee (like most of the right wing preachers) seems to reserve his anger for those who are already on the receiving end of those injustices.

Why is that hardly ever mentioned? As good as the rightys are at spouting off their arbitrary list of "differences" (20 years, married, baptized, squaaaawk), , I don't see many pointing out the difference between making controversial comments towards those who have done wrong towards others, and comments towards those who have done "wrong" things in the eyes of conservatives, but things that are really none of the cons business.

Yes, we should all sit there and let some angry bitter nut tell us Americans how we should acknowledge our past sins, no thanks Colonel - I don't need the likes of Reverend Jeremiah Wright lecturing me on anything, if you need it for some reason, then so be it.  I don't.

As for comparing their rhetoric, both are irrelevant to this campaign, as neither is running for anything.  So you can applaud one, and despise the other, it's all a personal choice. 

You're veering off there, Tommy. I don't attend any church, let alone Wright's, but nice job of completely avoiding my point with your little "I don't need a lecture" whine. I suppose if I needed a lecture, I'd go to church, or take some night classes.

You seem a little bothered by Wright's "friendly reminders", and that's OK with me.I don't expect anything more.

Bothered?  You are the one who seems to need the scolding that Wright is handing down, not me.  If you have some level of guilt, don't assume the rest of us share that, I am perfectly fine with dismissing Wright as an irrelevancy, you are not.

And I very much answered your question in the context of this political campaign, let me remind you again, neither of these pastors is running for office.

Or did I miss that? 

Nah, I'm all set on scoldings, and I don't think Wright's comments can even compare to Hagee's. That's because I understand them, so obviously I don't need them.

I'm not going to tell anybody else what they need,Tommy.I don't think you even get the difference between the focus of the two pastors, which makes you unqualified to even say if you need any of their comments.

I do agree with you on one thing; Both clergymen are irrelevant to the presidential campaign.Your hypocrisy is in thinking because you've not condoned the Wright media blitz, not condoning the much-more -ignored Hagee stuff makes you consistent, and validates your criticism of MMFA for pointing out these things.

Colonel, Your arrogance is astounding, and I am perfectly glad you understand Wright's comments, good for you.

But I am curious, you speak of my hypocrisy on this issue, when yours screams out.  For you wallow in Wright's wild-eyed hate-filled rants because it soothes your guilt, that's obvious by the way "you understand them and I don't", yet you think his comments are getting too much airtime?, when you should be doing cartwheels with glee because Wright is getting the exposure and has the opportunity to take his scolding tour on a much more national stage to explain his wackiness to all of us who just don't get it.

Why are you complaining about that Colonel, you should be thrilled?

 

'...you wallow in Wright's wild-eyed hate-filled rants because it soothes your guilt, that's obvious by the way "you understand them and I don't", '

Understanding = wallowing in/having guilt soothed. OK, if you're just going to be silly, I won't bother. Have a swell weekend, Tommy. Forgive my arrogance if you can.

 

Fine, don't answer my question about why you are so annoyed at all the Wright media coverage however you feel it's something we as Americans need to hear.  

Your contradictions make no sense, perhaps that is why you avoid it. 

Tommy,You're only seeing contradictions because of your own view of the topic. I'm not bothered by anybody hearing the comments of Rev. Wright. I'd love for people to not only hear them, but understand them.

This would most likely happen in this context;listen to an entire sermon, or at least a good long passage, with an open mind, and using some critical thinking skills.

Then, agree or disagree, at least know what you're disagreeing with.

This will probably not happen with a shrieking Sean Hannity introduction of "hate-filled" "bigoted" "anti-American" "squawk squawk, etc" followed by a loop of "God Damn America!"

You're on the turf now of those posters who constantly accuse others of "hating disagreement", or insulting those with a different opinion.

There's nothing I like more than discussing things with those who disagree with me. It's just very boring to keep knocking down strawmen, and trying to have a talk with somebody who's disagreeing with something that nobody said.

The Wright issue has been on these boards countless times. I may have missed it, but up to this point, I still haven't seen one conservative poster who seems to understand it enough to make a distinction between the anger of Wright at injustices of our country towards it's citizens, and the Hagee-types anger at American citizens just trying to live their lives, and other things that are none of their business.

Col,

I am all for having substantive discussions about the topics that Reverend Wright talks about, that is fine.  But two things, they don't belong in this presidential campaign as he is not running for president, so those discussions are for other venues.

Secondly, as for those topics themselves, you can soften his rhetoric by wanting people to hear and understand him, but the fault for people reacting the way they do and viewing him as an angry bitter vengeful man is HIS fault, not ours.  I don't care what Hannity did to facillitate it or not, or how out of context those words were, they were his very words, uttered by him, his responsibility.  If you want to have serious heartfelt discussions you don't haul out idiotic, unproved accusations that we Americans introduced AIDS to kill black people and GOD DAMN AMERICA!  He said those things, we didn't.

Don't whine about not having your message heard and understood when you live off that inflammatory rhetoric, that is on him, not us.  I will not take anyone seriously when they operate from that premise, and speak such lunacy.

I have no respect for the man, but as I said, he isn't running for anything so it matters very little.

When he apologizes for his accusations, then that would be a good starting point for those discussions you feel are so important.   

I don't care what Hannity did to facillitate it or not, or how out of context those words were, they were his very words, uttered by him, his responsibility

If you don't care about media misinformation, then why are YOU here.

To disrupt those who do care.

Nice job remaining civil in the wake of that bizarre and personal potshot.

Col, that aside...everyone should read this article:

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/5939999/reverend_doomsday/

Thanks, I just skimmed it (I'm at work), but will check it out over the weekend. LaHaye is another winner in that bunch. But at least he didn't say anything crazy, like mentioning that the KKK existed in America.Just the demonic posession of Saddam Hussein, factual stuff like that.

Oh Yeah, and he didn't baptize Bush's kids, etc.

I understand your sentiments, but he basically hand-picked Bush back in 00.  Seems fitting that we went into Iraq after seeing LaHaye's views on the matter.

DB, I think you may have misread my sarcasm. I consider LaHaye way more wacky than Wright.

I don't need the likes of Reverend Jeremiah Wright lecturing me on anything

And therein lies your arrogant ignorance. 

Fox News' misinformative report aside, I find it insightful to know that McCain draws a line in the sand and FINALLY rejects Hagee's endorsement, not for his claim that God kills gays and those who condone homosexuality, but at the claim that Hitler was performing God's will.  I was beginning to wonder when and if McCain was ever going to make this political calculation.

I dunno...it was still a prettty close call in the McCain camp.  ;>)

An audio recording of that meeting to weigh the pros and cons of keeping the endorsement of a man who believes Hitler was sent by God would be truly puke-inducing.

Gov, 

Hold on the meme even if it is no longer operable. :-)  Hagee had already apologized for his Katrina comments along with his comments regarding Catholics.

 

Hagee believes God sent Katrina to kill gays and that God sent Hitler to kill jews.  You can't unring that bell.

When that bill rings the beginning of the Hagee for President campaign, then you can vote against him and urge your fellow citizens to do the same.

Until then, his comments are as irrelevant as yours. 

his comments are as irrelevant as yours.

 

But he get 2,408 Google News hits and I get zero. :( 

What the crap!? Now he's getting 2400 Google News hits and he's the 4th top US news story.  I'm getting a raw deal here.  Tommy, will you be my pooplasict?

Thanks for the info Governor, who is #1, 2 and 3?  And can you reprint their nutty statements too so we can evaluate them in the midst of the presidential race that is being discussed here - as they would be even more relevant than Hagee, that is using your barometer.

Hagee is now #2, and it's not my critria, it's something called The Google:

http://news.google.com/?ned=us&topic=n

Gov.

You probably think all sorts of things about Rove and Bush. So what?

Hagee apologized and retracted his earlier comments about Katrina and Catholics.  It looks to me like you hold on to these disavowed comments only to further your agenda.

When did you learn about the Hitler comments?

Show me where Hagee ever apologized for his God sent Katrina to wipe out New Orleans statement...please!

“As a believing Christian, I see the hand of God in everything that happens here on earth, both the blessings and the curses,” Hagee said in a statement issued through his public relations firm. “But ultimately neither I nor any other person can know the mind of God concerning Hurricane Katrina. I should not have suggested otherwise. No matter what the cause of the storm, my heart goes out to all who suffered in this terrible tragedy. There but for the grace of God go any one of us.

-Hagee somewhere around April 24th.

http://www.boston.com/news/politics/politicalintelligence/2008/04/hagee_retracts.html

So, any idea if he did it in front of his church? Or perhaps in any of the large venues like he used to make the comments. No of course not, have your press agent say you are sorry you pretended to know God's will and that is enough. I am sure all of his parishioners are aware he took back those statements as well.

My guess is they are a lot more informed about their pastor than one particular church goer in Chicago. ;-)

As with most of your posts, guessing is about all you have.

Hagee may have apologized for his comments about Hurricane Katrina, I don't know. What I do know is that the religious right has been following a pattern.

Each tragedy that befalls an American city, from the attacks of New York and Washington DC to Hurricane Katrina has been judged by the leaders of the religious right to be deserved for the sinful ways of the cities involved.

What kind of God would show his anger at the ACLU and liberals by killing almost 3,000 people at their jobs on September 11, 2001?

What kind of God punishes the Pentagon and I suppose our military by attacking the Pentagon on the same day for the same crimes of liberalism and perversion?

What kind of God destroys the 9th Ward in NO because there was going to be a parade in the French Quarter, which was one of the few areas of the city left unscathed?

These men didn't say "God Damn America", they said that God has already damned us. To me that is despicable.

They follow their pattern, they claim to know the mind of God, then they apologize at a later date. Probably after they suck millions of dollars from their gullible followers.

If these men are men of God, then count me as an enemy of them and their god. 

Hagee had already apologized for his Katrina comments along with his comments regarding Catholics.

And your proof of that is presented where? McCain knew of Hagee's comments about gays and calling the Catholic Church "the great whore," and he still sought out and courted Ha